Magic of Attraction Methods, one of the best result-driven dating coaches I’ve seen in a LONG TIME, has published a video with his perspective on negs and neg theory and why it’s COUNTER PRODUCTIVE to you getting women and why it actually HURTS your self-esteem and confidence.
Talk about a different perspective from the common pro-arguments out there for negs.
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That’s counter intuitive from what I had learned from love systems, rsd, neil strauss and mystery. I had never considered that it would actually communicate to me that I wasn’t good enough.
this guy seems legit. too legit to quit. id like to see more from him
cool – i like his perspective. first i’ve ever heard of this indian guy.
i look forward to more from you. do you have any bootcamps in new york city coming up?
Makes sense
I’ve just started getting back into the SC and this is what I find out? That the last year after reading the game was a waste of time? lol All good i had a feeling that it was unnatural anyways. thanks “Magic” if thats ur real name
bullshit! I stick by what mystery said….
mystery is old news man. he hasn’t done shit in years. probably snorting coke
This makes a lot of sense. I’ve realized Negs only work in say, the city of Los Angeles. You can be a jerk, use Negs, and girls will dig that. But, if you use Negs in San Francisco, girls will not give you the time and day. I came off as rude. I realized girls in SF are more laid back. I’ve gotten more play in LA with Negs, then did in Ohio, or Colorado because girls are used to it, or they just get hit on alot, and when some guy Negs them, they’re like, “What’s with this guy, he’s not hitting on me?” Negs only work depending on the girl and environment.
He raises some good points. but maybe I don’t fully understand a “neg”… if you say something that seems like a negative remark and has humour (and delivered right), (“I *love* that dress on you! How long is Bjork letting you borrow it?”) then it seems like you’re communicating the same way you would with close a friend. It’s also very important to calibrate – you wouldn’t say this to someone wearing a hideous dress – just something a little different.
As long as your frame of mind is not to put her down (thus seeming to raise your own status) but rather to gently poke fun and to have a good time – and have her have a good time, too, I think negs can be used (sparingly). I think it communicates that you don’t take yourself too seriously and that she shouldn’t take herself too seriously, either.
right on. finally. I’m a savvy chick who’s read THE GAME and who’s been approached by many guys and I’d rather this guy’s approach and mind-set any day or night. one neg for fun can make an opener impact (as long as it’s funny/original) but too many and/or too much being poked fun at is B-O-R-I-N-G. a guy who shows confidence and creates fun, good vibes and dynamic, positive conversation is always way more interesting and sexy. trust me.
ps despite the fact this clip should have been edited to take out the bit in the middle when Magic moves to another topic (which was sounding interesting too), Magic handles it with style. Nice.
I always knew this to be true… negs are very unatural. someone women who are actually worth getting to know are very turned off by this.
SexyMichael… you understand a neg better than this guy… the purpose of negs is to communicate humor/fun/comfort… not to try “elevate” yourself. I agree with him that if you’re walking around trying to show how cool you are… you’re actually doing the opposite…
@Cain @SexyMichael
I’ve been in the community since before The Game and what Magic says is accurate. The purpose whether it is playful or humorous or mean is to bring down a girls value. That’s the reason for it. Otherwise, you’d just give her a compliment, right? Why else throw in a jab with a compliment? Because you need something DONE…. The point isn’t that a neg isn’t just FLIRTING. It’s designed for a specific kind of beautiful woman because the inventor of the neg thinks he needs to bring down that woman’s PERCEIVED value towards you or INCREASE your value – either way your pulling or pushing a value of someone in the interaction.
I stopped using negs a few years ago as I NEVER had a good reaction from them. Which is funny because cocky and funny gets me wildly good results, so my skill with tonality and attitude with it you’d figure would be right on. I think I agree with what Magic said in this video. Guys who get laid often with beautiful girls simply don’t use negs.
@sentinel & Loki… precisely!
you guys can come game me anytime. your original fun attitudes + compliments (rather than boring and lame ol’ negs for cool chicks) = an uber chic recipe to spice up the chat mix with confidence on both sides… and any chick that doesn’t dig that approach is probably just a mixed up babe anyhow.
LOL thanks Chic Chick. I bet most guys that endorse negs don’t get laid. It works in “theory” but not in the real world.
I’ve never liked the concept of negs and have always struggled with the idea as I have always seen it as a very non alpha male thing to do. Alpha’s build comfort and rapport and flirt in a confident fun manner, creating win win situations. They have no need to bring someone down as they are completely confident in their own skin. Negs to me simply display a level of insecurity.
I agree with Loki that cocky and funny (providing you remember that both parties are supposed to find it funny) gets really good results and is a lot more fun for everyone.
A neg is used in group theorie to convain that you are not a potential suiter. If you neg your target while you demonstrate value against the group you wil auto get ioi’s from the target.
For the rest a 10 is a model or stripper and in my eyes a girl with a boyfriend.
You must neg a stripper or a model because she is used to get ioi’s all day long. So if u iod her then she will wake up and get to earth!
You acctualy dont want to neg a beautifull girl at a night club because that is normaly not higher than a 7!!!
This is nothing new, and later David Deangelo advanced material (not early cocky and funny stuff) refers to it a lot.
I too went through the neg phase. It does give newbies a boost because they’re being kind of different and it is better than looking desperate. And that’s a key component of negs, they communicate detachment from the girl, no need for her validation.
However if your inner game is strong enough, you don’t need negs to get that point across. And then you can give genuine compliments, and girls will take them for what they are and they will love it. And they will tell they’re girlfriend and they will compliment you back.
Personally I am very glad I moved on from a more negative game and into a very positive one. But I look back and see it as part of a path and of my growth.
Everyone thanks for contributing!
VM I think you bring up a good point. “It does give newbies a boost because they’re being kind of different and it is better than looking desperate.” I think, and I could be wrong, that its a choice between “feeling good during” as opposed to getting through the hard beginning journey and just learning the right things from the start.
Hi Donovan,
You’re probably right on that. Maybe learning the right way from the start is better for many or most. I still can imagine that it may be hard at least for some. Sometimes you get certain inner feelings associated with certain attitudes and it might be easier to first do something completely different do something similar but correctly, than just fix what’s broken. But that said doing the right thing from the start is certainly preferable if possible.
ya this guy gets laid
dude,
negs don’t work? yes they do.
Go look in the mirror or take a big whiff. Maybe it’s something else that is “not working” instead of the negs..
lol
it could be something else thats not working but its the principle of the negs that is flawed and coming from a place of ‘im not good enough for this girl’ bad bad bad
otherwise, its just teasing which is fine but not the way mystery has done it in all other videos. he does it with a cold voice and moves his body language away from the target. it always gets a reaction but its more time wasted instead of just making out with her instead of trying to lower her value
>> mystery is old news man. he hasn’t done shit in years. probably snorting coke
And hopefully he stays that way and doesn’t re-emerge to poison the public with his psychopathic attitudes which has done little more than screw with people heads and get them literally zero real life results (sex, relationships) results with women.
Yes “mystery started this community” and yes “mystery gets more girls than you” and so on, yet the above still holds true.
Mystery – keep staying away.
The main problem with people using the mystery method is that most of them have a very superficial understanding of it. It’s like karate newbies trying to fight after learning a couple of forms, they look like drones and would be better off without nothing.
You are all AFC’s or AMOG’s and I BUST your ass.
This AMOG movie is some guy who say’s he approach tens but acctually it is his neighbour and he sees her as a ten lol.
And his neigbour is 47 also so dont use too much negs!
You will insult the girl and she will be pist off old marry clappin!!
And if not post pictures of him with a stripper or a ten, come on!!
In 3 day’s from AFC > PUA Hahahahahahahahhahahahahahahhahaha.
Who is snorting coke?
Go look in the mirror or take a big whiff. Maybe it’s something else that is “not working” instead of the negs..
I love mystery for all the good influence in my life!!!
And if you do not believe in him don’t hate him on his own website.
Show a litle bit of respect because the path he has walked was not the easyest.
Respect from Holland, Amsterdam
About Neg theory and 10′s: Its true what this guy says. I’m dating the Playboy Playmate of the Year and I picked her up off of MySpace. I ONLY go after 10′s… I’m not interested in merely getting “laid” – That’s for amateurs… I hunt big game – 10′s with Q-Ratings… everything else is a waste of my time. For the same reason I don’t go out trolling for 7′s, 8′s and9′s…. waste of time.
My MySpace page has 2200 models on it, most are 10′s – I’ve I’ve flown in about 100 of them to stay with me in NYC…..
Magic is the real deal! He used to be a coach for Brad P before he started his own company and was on David D’s Man Transformation. He has amazing reviews on his site and attraction forums as well. Talk all the shit you want but he is the one getting laid.
I asked Magic if he had coached for Brad P previously and he said he had while Brad was in transition for replacing a coach, so he needed help during a short time. Magic is friends with Brad P and although they have different approaches (to their methodology) they both are great teachers and care about their students.
Oh, and you’d welcome them into your social circle as friends…
This is very true, I always used to do negs and I felt stupid for doing them, first of all I was totally uncalibrated and negged on every opportunity I got. I think newbies see negs as a holy grail to get hot chicks.
You should only use negs when she does something you don’t like. For instance when you give her a hoop to jump through and she won’t comply, then you neg her and/or act disinterested.
Or when you qualify her and she won’t comply, neg her/show disinterest.
Actually neg has alot of misconceptions in the community, it’s just a way to show disinterest, it’s not supposed to be insulting like: “That’s lovely long hair – are they extensions?” or “Nice nails – are they acrylic. Oh, well they look good anyway.”
Can’t you see this is very insulting to the woman?
Just be generally nice to woman, and if you can’t fclose them, then make them your friends, use them as pivots and social proof.
You’re just handicapping yourself by using negs, especially if done wrong. It took me a long while to learn this, but my game improved A LOT since I almost completely dropped negs.
Wow this negs concept is very new to me very helpful. I like mystery methods although I have not obtained any really good results.
>> I like mystery methods although I have not obtained any really good results.
Nor did 99.99999% of the people who used it. Of the entire dating advice industry or seduction community, students of this method have BY FAR the lowest success rate.
Wow. First time I read about negs, I didn’t feel they were right. This guy makes a very good summary of what’s wrong with them.
PS: What he says about 10′s is true! Well, pretty women in general, they tend to be very nice. Ugly ones, not only they are ugly, they are insecure, rude, have complex, don’t have many activities, etc.
I’ve never tried studying this because I already had my girlfriend when I found out about game.
I understand that maybe Mistery isn’t God, but to have done what he did he must have had some sort of results, no?
@Zictor
Yes, he got results… but so do the jocks threating woman like crap, or that badass motorcycle guy who doesn’t give a crap about the woman he’s riding.
Mystery is a guy who was fed up with being crap with woman and went out to find a system that works for HIM. For HIS personality. We should all go out and find our own way of achieving this, and never give up until we do. (And hopefully it’s not a misogynous way) It’s going to be hard, I’m not gonna lie. Rejection is inevitable. But you must not see it as rejection, but as learning experiences, it’s the only way to become good.
I partially agree with Magic. The whole idea behind negs is to elevate your perceived value in the targets mind, but this rarely seems to be effective. I think a lot of 10s pick up on this. However, negs do seem to be more effective on 7s and 8s.
In my own experience, I found negs to be a band aid approach that should be avoided unless they can be successfully diluted with humor especially if your looking for more than a one nighter.
Oldman has a good point. Find what works for you. Mystery’s system may not work for you, but it can’t be denied that the man is a trailblazer and deserves respect.
@MO
True, he’s a real inspiration, and if he can do it (along with Style, David DeAngelo, AFC Adam Lyons, Gambler, etc), then anyone with the same determination can.
He’s overthinking it. IME a neg is only useful in the first few minutes of interaction. It’s not about how you view your own social value, it’s how you go about communicating it. I have a lot of great attributes, but it’s a turn-off to go up to a girl and just list your qualities. You do the neg to demonstrate you’re not like all the other guys, then open her up to discovering those qualities about you that are attractive.
BTW here’s a neg that works really well. It combines with direct. “Hi, you’re kind of cute in a dorky sort of way. Are you more than just a pretty face?”
I’ve also used this with success: “Hi, I’m thinking of hitting on you, but I only really connect with interesting people. Are you interesting enough?”
I’m so sick of the Brad Pitt comparisons. Stars are generally very nice because people kiss their ass all day. It’s the the b-list actors who have loads of talent and training — but ar not on the a-list because they don’t have the right look or “it”quality — that are assholes. Because they’re jealous.
I’d say a neg is a tool. The negs designed to lower social value with an offhand comment, one that isn’t funny in any way, looks like a dick move. It feels wrong to a lot of people, but it still can get results toward seduction.
I’ve always like cocky teasing, pointing out something a woman’s said and turning it around on her, but always in a jokeing way.
You can’t always be nice to everyone, and sometimes a woman you meet, expecially in a group, is going to play rough with you. If I’m being messed with by a defensive girl who is trying to lower my value in her friends eyes then I’ll throw a crueler neg her way eventually, better than being a pushover I think.
This concept of BEING the better man, having your inner game down so you’re unshakable, as well as being an interesting person who doesn’t need to spit game….. it’s a great concept. It will take people a while to get there. It took me seeing results and using different tools/techniques before I could look at how my life had changed with success to figure out how I needed to improve my life on a deeper level. Thus emphasis on inner game.
I don’t think this guy is in any way wrong, but for me a Serious (not joking) neg is for knocking someone down off a high horse that they themselves have climbed up on.
Go ahead and be Sir Lancelots 24/7 if you all want to though.
He emphasises inner work over technique, which shows he’s a serious player in this game. It shows he knows there is more to enjoying life than fornication.
Well when it comes to negs I used them sparingly. It depends, using more than 1-2 negs in a 5 minute span on a 10 means she will walk away, if its the first meeting. There nothing wrong with that 50% of girls probably don;t want to meet anyone new on any given night.
However after 1st meeting negs are fair game to bring the ego in check. 10s like bad boys and you can toss on a bunch of negs but you have to do it when you want to do it, not in response to her. The trick is for the man to control the situation always. For example, a girl says she doesn’t like something your doing, tell her to go home and cry to mommy about it and you don’t care and laugh. Act totally disinterested in her and for some strange reason it makes them want you more. I have girls who use negs on me, but only after the first encounter. Women are very childish, most of what the mystery method type books showed I already knew. The one thing I had problem with was meeting random women and getting to the making out and so on stages, that usually took me far longer.
I basically figured out these approaches when I realized that any women I made friends with in high school and beyond started to like me ( I would hear from so and so that … likes me and it later became … wants to f— me). It was then I realized that you make friendship first (at leats in her mind) then the banging comes later. problem for me is I’m not attracted to girls I see every day.
Lets face reality 10s can pick and choose in a club. I think negs work on 10s if you already know them but initial meeting needs to be all positive otherwise your probably not seeing a 10 again. Any other girl yes.
How the Hell does he figure that 3 or 4 people out of 60 translates to .5%? He’s WAY off. Maybe he thinks being bad at maths is a turn-on?
It amazes me how WOMEN consistenly come and comment on this site. Fact is, a woman is always going to defend her womanhood and engage a digital ASD mechanisms when leaving feedback.
NOW
As for this guy and his view of NEGS…I agree that some guys don’t know what a NEG is.
A NEG WORKS! It is simply a playful tease. “are those nails real” is NOT a NEG. “nice eyes…can I touch them” is definitely NOT a neg
Like Matador said..well..like I SAY (and Im not a pua..i’m just good at meeting women mates) IF A WOMEN DOES NOT LAUGH ATER YOUR PLAYTFUL TEASE OR “NEG” you are doing it WRONG
Play..tease…cocky..funny. DO NOT INSULT OR MANIPULATE.
Cheers,
Superman J
This is shit, mystery method is the best. You show u’r value with negs, show that u’r not afraid , you feel well talking to the girl and stuff like that. I offer everyone to use mystery material…
He just explained why it didn’t work. You don’t understand it?